Posted by Georg Künstler (217.2.167.158) on January 05, 2003 at 10:18:59:
In Reply to: Re: Besslerwheel vs. centrifugal/centripetal forces... posted by Øystein Rustad on January 04, 2003 at 03:25:13:
: I see what you mean, but what if somehow the wheel benefited from this centrifugal force ?
: I have until recently viewed the centrifugal force as destructive for gravity-power, but recently I found that if speed is altered when lifting / lowering, because energy is transferred back / forth between springs, one can harness gravity based on its conservative function !
: Something like MT 17 (not that I plan to use the MT 17 principle, but just have a way to show what I mean :-)
: where the weights first move very slow, then accelerated nearer the top, and follow the rim on the way down.
: If you calculate the masses centrifugal force in that picture,
: you see one way how centrifugal force can be altered, when another principle is used where the masses are !
: Then centrifugal forces can be removed when lifting....
: Example :weights are forced out towards the rim as they fall, compressing a spring.
: When lifted, the weights will resist lifting and strech another spring, that means that the weights loose their velocity.
: When they loose their velocity, the centrifugal forces are reduced, and the compressed spring will push the weights towards center, and the lift will be easier....
: Ehhh, if that was somehow understandable ?
: How is your book project going by the way ?
:
: : Hi Oystein,
: : Centrifugal force applied to free-to-move-weights within the wheel suggests huge mechanical difficulties when calculated for the uni-directional Draschwitz wheel.
: : This wheel was reported as rotating at 50 RPM and was 9.13 feet diameter. At this speed centrifugal force applied to a weight at the rim is much greater than 1G. IMO, this raises some pretty serious problems for any system that utilises a purely radial movement of the weights.
: : At full wheel speed (Draschwitz wheel) it would seem that a weight rotating with the rim would need a crowbar to lever it directly back in towards the axle.
: : Regards, Bill.
: :
: : : Hello again :-)
:
: : : For the ones int. I thought I should "bable" a bit about how besslers wheel was related to centrifugal forces mathematically !
:
: : : In his biggest wheel we can calculate how big the centrifugal forces wore, and from that see if they somehow could be a major factor, an maybe we can find a "lucky" relation !
:
: : : Lets see at what RPM the centrifugal forces will be equal to gravity !
:
: : : RPM(Fg = Fc) = (g * r)^1/2 * (60 / pi*2r)
: : : g = 9,8
: : : r = 1,825
:
: : : Resault = 22,1 RPM !
:
: : : At this RPM the weights are "weightless" at the top and
: : : have F = 2g at the bottom.
: : : We know this wheel rotated at about 24 RPM unloaded and about 20 RPM loaded.
:
: : : :-)
you are right with your opinion Øystein.
The calculation is correct.
I don't use springs in my solution, i transfer the 'Stop energy' to the weights and get a higher start-point.
So a lot of solutions are possible.
Best regards
Georg